i checked KRUPTOONS.com. i like a lot of his work, although i don't see the humor.... most of the issues are way too serious. i like the paintings the best. i love art.

i wouldn't try to tell him what to do or not to do. he's talented and must go in the direction he chooses, or the direction chooses him. at is funny that way. sometimes it's almost like the artist has no choice. i don't know enough about today's japan to have any insight. nice that he has a poet for a g/f - kindred souls sort of.

for me it's difficult to be a wordsmith for much of anything but tech. i seem to have lost most other vocabulary. i did think we are already friends...

bill's stuff is not too heavy or dense. it's his style. others do the same.

these days i prefer to catch phish rather than fish :)

dna strings? why do you think we have the same name lynne with the 'e'?

technically speaking - click add - but only if you don't mind typos. i do tons of them.... not intentionally, i'm just not a typist. i've been extremely careful in messages to you so far. once you click add - it's all over. no more being careful :)

web development,,, hmmm... ok, after you learn some of that - if you want to work in this field, this is what you need to learn: php, mysql, java*, a few others like that - and most urgent - making them secure - no holes in the code for hackers. if you can do that well, you can make a fortune. i feel like th only time i'm not online is sleeping or in the shower or similar... bad. i need to change that. i feel like my dna strand is connected to my machine :) it's really nice to get to know you - a soon to be geek :) enjoy your breakfast or lunch or whatever it is.

no ooops. that is how this works

string, strand, all the same to me. you really don't want to check out phish unless just to read about them. they are not safe. a drummer? nice...

i see you also are friends with geoff... nice guy. i like him.

web design is also a lot of design, graphics, knowing what is safe, (ie using a form instead of a mailto:) you can do it yourself too - at home. get photoshop and dreamweaver. you may want to start simple - with mozilla composer. there are tons of places online to seek answers and ask questions. if you go this route, when you're ready i'll give you the next steps. you need to learn the code and graphics first. the design - you need to understand art etc. also goog has a lot of info on placement on a page. i think it's with the adwords info, not sure. i haven't looked in ages.

too funny - i forgot about the music group phish. i was thinking of the bad stuff online! damn - i need a life!!!! i still like rock - blues and at times jazz

i want to scream on a regular basis :) interesting about your visions.... ya gotta crawl before you walk...

watching and reading about the riots in tehran

see twitter and bbc for best info

us press is not covering yet

hahahaha - no roses yet - too much rain. it's still raining.

the simpler stuff is easy to learn too. if you do it at home you just need self discipline and someone or someplace to ask questions and look up stuff.

is anyone here weird? nah.....

iran is unbelievable. all comminications stopps out of the country about 2 hours ago. us press has very little. there is more on the bbc, telegraph, and youtube. i was following a couple of ppl on twit in tehran. it's very bad there.

healing energy would be good. ty.

iran - what a mess and disaster. apparently votes were never even counted. tiots, demonstrations, violence. 120 members of the faculty of the university resigned in protest. secret police all over. false rumors. yesterday/last night all communication shut down, power also in some places. it is restored today. foreign news people - some - asked to leave the country. and lots more. the us press is not covering much except a few. bbc and telegraph in the uk doing a much better job. twit has the best info from ppl in tehran.

we're having the 40 days/nights again it seems. you want rain? t-storms? start in florida and go north. it's all over. i guess it's good for the ducks :)

Hi Lynne,

I like your point about dialogue, and let me give a quick explanation of my method in response.

Using base 5, rather than computing Base 2, or financial/economic Base 10/12, i started to evaluate communication ethics (big field, ten years work plus) and found that i a simple mathematical means used to structure the multi-modal nature of the many sources i was reading was helpful...i then found that by exploiting the method in simple graphical templates, what was complex became simple so that anyone could get hold of it, use it and share it. This 'open' method also implied a more collaborative approach to knowledge evaluation (because it is open and shares sources and concepts equally from all participants in similar formats). Such an insight also offers a re-situation of the technology-human relation. We humans really need a 'low-tech' solution to dealing with technology and overcoming its priority, one of the many reasons i like the globalsensemaking community as this is clearly their aim.

So thinking of communication ethics using the method, we divided the discipline into five domains, based on how its taught in unis., they are: political, media, organisation (network), group and interpersonal.

Now, applying that model to dialogue, an interesting/creative and critical outcome is suggested (heuristic knowledge not certainty, as you can appreciate):

interpersonal - monologue (concept exists, isn't there a lot of it?)
group - dialogue - concept exists but has to be more carefully differentiated from debate and other forms of group communication as you mention.
organisation - decalogue - exists in medieval lit. Boccacio's Decameron, but more fittingly describes a multi-streamed communication limited by certain frameworks.
media - multilogue - as you suggest, but describing a massive interpretive cultural/technological communication beyond anyone to confront?
political - demologue - i'm not sure this concept exists elswhere, although rather useful. It describes a political act which Habermas, following Plato amongst others, puts at the heart of democracy. Funny, but in my studies of language it appears that quite often political language is omitted, hollowed out or carefully prescribed to reduce the value of words that call to account the political systems and powers...?

I am completing a research project on the nature of corporate dialogue practices, (for the record, minimal), and then straight onto the software development which wraps the base 5 numerics into a transparent, communication ethics based approach to visual presentation of data/information/communication/knowledge/judgement - BTW the models are integrated by running a 36 grid in which each heuristic is mapped against another, creating such two-word concepts as political dialogue, media dialogue, organisation dialogue etc - this displays a sort of optimum dialectical pattern for total implications of using the two models together.

Anyone can use the method 5+...and everyone does...its just that by formalising our social sense-making in simple numeric structures (visually the patterns are stunnning following from chaos, complexity, geometry, planatary and cellular, 'organic' patterns), while the key link is the simple numeric base beneath the template visuals.

Its an open source approach - we have a gateway symbol for communication ethics, which is our property, but other than that anyone can play the game - and they can devise their own gateway and build their own cultured approaches which we can then share...

These ideas have been published over a number of years and are now commonly used by governments and corporations alike, especiially in the education and sustainability fields.

Personally, I'm just interested in seeing a more ethical human-participative domain where people can flourish through their own critical-creative expression, and the myths of a violent-intemperate past are diminished to assist evolve our species. Women are at the forefront of this all, and my partner and women friends all respond to the system in a similar way...this is how we think...

Please read Plato's Republic (despite terrifying lack of women!!) to see that original dialogues were not competitive at their core - appearance/actuality is part of a subverted Pythagorean inception in which Plato was immersed and which suggested that knowledge was given out in certain ways to reduce its distortion - dialogue in Plato is part of an eductational-community practice that sorts knowledge via self-governance... surely where we are getting back to now, only using ICT to 'memorise' and 'comparatise'...

Aristotle and the Roman Church diminished Plato's 'divine' achievement I believe, and in doing so diminished much Western thought including the separation of women and the heresy of reincarnation. Of course, logics also laid out by Plato (the dialectic, drawn from the Pythagoreans) were taken up by Aristotle, and became a source of technological thinking (not sense-making), certainly an achievement of the West...now the pendulum has swung to the East and look at the alacrity with which the Asian cultural traditions embrace the technological (dialectical) connected to a more hermeneutic (creative-circular) impulse...a natural human impluse that saw the circle of life as the centre of a spiritual-rational worldview, in the Pythagorean tradition, organsied through number and the balance of the feminine restored...

It's no conincidence that Pythagoras, Zoraster, Buddha, Confucius and Lao Tze all lived with a a life time of one another (about 150 years, so maybe two long lives).

I must get back to work and hope this aside does not sound too didactic...i can't read the text as a whole and there is no pause button, to offer me the editor's priviledge of an overnight test...hope all well with you...regards robert

thx for the healing energy. i did go get a few things for my friend in the afternoon. she is in very bad shape. much worse than me but different problems. it was too much for me. i was wiped out after. but i did get vit c. i started taking it yesterday afternoon and by the middle of the night started feeling better. was that the vit c or your healing energy or both? i dunno. am i better today? i dunno. not until i wake up.

My wife taught me to love cats... I truly empathize with their cattitudes, but something about being human compels me to be less self-centered than cats. Still, cats make me feel needed - if only to put out food, open doors, and provide a warm body on which they can sleep. I get along with most animals better than most people... non-verbal dialogue has its advantages.

Going back to my childhood, when I learned to mediate conflicts between my siblings (I was 2nd of 4), it seems I've always been a peacemaker. [Defn: Peacemaker - one who takes the blame from both sides.] Needless to say that I have been struck (literally) on the other cheek on more than one occasion. I long ago gave up on religion and am left with this internalized assumption that to be truly human (i.e., not divine) requires that one be prepared to make sacrifices for the well-being of others. It's not that I much care about being blessed, I'd just prefer that we all learn to live in peace.

too funny lynne with an e

i needed a laugh. watch the developments in iran.... very bad s ituation now and events are moving rapidly.

Hi Lynne,

I'll forward your references to whiteravenwaiting, Jule,who is much involved in the aboriginal rights and indigenous people's movements, and is interested in women's cultural history - a lovely book by an aboriginal elder called 'secret women's business' is one of her references...i'll have to take a few days on responses to your perspectives as i'm dealing with the effects of trying to rid my pc of its security software and the undeletable part of this intrusive malware is now messing with my internet connection...rb

book worth reading when it comes out...


Relational Being
Beyond Self and Community
Kenneth J. Gergen
bookshot Add to Cart
ISBN13: 9780195305388ISBN10: 0195305388 Hardback, 448 pages
Jun 2009, Not Yet Published
Price:
$45.00 (05)
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don't mistake me - i've have no bone to pick with those who find meaning/strength/comfort in religion. my degree is in religious studies (from a Christian Bros. university - though i was raised Methodist) and i almost had a double major in philosophy. now days, i'm a practicing accountant (w/o degree). spirituality, to me is an individual thing... each must find his/her own path. religion is a group thing - and when it becomes "group-think", i am cautious/concerned. i'm more into finding rhythms in nature (not exactly animism - but i do believe in sacred places and abstract energies that transcend the concrete world).

"does not include violent extremists or those who believe that their way is the only way..." - i am totally with you on this. think the writer of John's gospel made it up - i.e., i don't believe Jesus ever said, "I am the way, the truth, and the life." i think Jesus' message was more, 'do as i do and you will find peace.' for example, the miracle of the loaves and the fishes was not about a miraculous creation of food - it was about people opening their hearts and sharing: if every one shares there will always be enough for every one. i think lao tsu said something to that effect that one will never have enough until one learns that enough is enough (terrible paraphrasing of Tao Te Ching #41).

peace

Hi Lynne, i'm back although still with tech. difficulties...no irony considering.. i think best way to express what i'm talking about is simply to use a simple constructive approach to designing, or evaluating any knowledge... construct your own method (intuition plus good library skills is a start)...take dialogue,there so many sources and so much case material...it needs ordering to me...you however may feel happy to work with single method and build your experience throught practice - my next intention after what i'm currently working on...not sure this anwers you but i'll try and respond to your other questions and see how we go...rb

i'll look up white tailfeather woman...i'm pleased to have this name so thanks...rb

Yes, this is good and i've sent to whiteraven waiting...more tending and befriending please...

well i'm finally getting a reasonable flash website that will explain some of this...the 5method is a simple means of structing information...all you do is tak an idea like dialogue and break ot down...you may find one or two sorts to begin with, but as your study deepens you'll find that variety may increase at more than one level...if you may this out (visualise it) the simple impact is to show how all knowledge is built up of accepted language and terms (dominant ones are the bain of many lives) and these can be easily represented...finally the power of the computer will assist our sense-making not just our doing...i'll let you knwo when we go live...rb

do-gooder getting paid? i don't think so although i'd love to get paid. btw, most geeks don't get the money you think we get. you hear about a couple of them. that's it. since so much is off shored - it's tough to even find work - at any price. there is beauty in almost everything if you look. did you see the pics of the volcano erupting in/near japan taken from space? that is a sight to see. here's one: http://antwrp.gsfc.nasa.gov/apod/astropix.html
you can find more on the same site.
i'm almost all better now, just screwed up sleeping and not as much energy as normal. at least i can function!

well, i'm back now... sort of... today is payroll processing day for me (including paying my boss who lives in Vancouver, BC) so i'm rather busy... spent last three days house-painting with my Wife and didn't hardly touch a computer...

i don't do much good... but last week someone to whom i gave technical assistance/re Americans with Disabilities Act (last year) received letters form US DOJ, informing him that local government entities would be compelled to sign Settlement Agreements with US DOJ due to their failure to comply with ADA... one small victory for little guys in which i had very small part. if i could afford to live without paycheck, i'd do this part of my job for free.

Lynne, just a geopolitical fact FYI: CS is at the radical right margin of the political spectrum and Manitou is at the opposite end; i lived in Dgo for 20 years B4 coming to CS, but i'm a Chicago native (explaining why i am a progressive, but not a member of the Democratic Party - i've never been able to escape childhood perception that Democrats - per the Daley Machine - are corrupt or at least undisciplined). i love CO and the outdoor life, but often find myself so tangled in the political weeds of El Paso County that i don't get out to appreciate where i live... the last time i hiked to the top of Pikes Peak was in 2003... something wrong with that.

hey, have a good weekend - i'm going to check out some (live) music.

geology major? i would think that's so interesting. a few years ago i was cracking up about this - i was in a museum in denver and got to see rocks on display from around here! it does sound like you do notice the small things in life, which are usually the most important.

happy july 4th! fireworks here are rained out!

Hi Lynne,

I hope your sister and family stuff get sorted and best wishes until then...been busy myself and will send updates when ready...regards robert

Hi Lynne,
I've been away too...good news...two university computing depts. have agreed to produce a working prototype for my software...although i'm now madly trying to convert my social science perspectives into something technologists can build...so hold any applause until they confirm the complete design as achiveable, sometime next month...i hope you and your family are well...keep in touch as i'm going to need wise people for this project, if-when it takes off...i should say wise women...i've been watching how they are using women as a political issue in Afghanistan...positining men as war-makers over centuries - so say all of us - and women as potential peace makers...this is a message that appears to be being orchestrated by political systems now, as the 'rationalists' realise the whole existing edifice is under so much strain from the speed and scope of change, that they need to resort to some decent first principles in order to enable some coherence in a world gone mad...clearly womanhood is our nearest first principle...best rb

All was going very well, and

very busy, till I hit a slick patch on a bridge deck on the bike path about 10 days ago... now, I am recovering from contusions, abrasions, lacerations, and general sensation that I've had my ribs whacked with a baseball bat... I'll post a picture of my recently retired helmet... how 'bout you? good summer?

sorry to hear of your loss. life is precious. i am lucky/grateful to be alive and functioning.
we have no grandchildren yet. my son & his wife are 28/27 and contemplating grad school options - not planing "pitter-patter of little feet". my stepdaughter is getting married in 2 weeks, but i think there are grad school considerations there, too. congratulations to you, though. grandkids must be fun. Uncle Teddy - a great loss, but thank god we had him for so long. he served in the Senate since before i knew what a Senator is...
autumn: favorite time of year... maybe it will stop raining?
take care.

Oh, I'm sure our kids (except my daughter, Sharon, who is 40, and has sworn she will never) will have grandkids in due time. I was younger than my son, George, is now, when he was born. I had just turned 50, when he graduated from college ('04, and he had taken a year off to live in Germany, right after high school). Personally, I enjoyed running, hiking, biking, etc with him when he was in high school, and I was still young enough to keep up. Biking is the only way I can do that anymore (cycling in the mountains, due to gravity, gives little guys like me some advantage on the climbs).
George's wife, Domenica, is Peruvian, and they really value large/extended families. I think that she has 3 siblings and 4 half-siblings. When we were at her mother's house in Lima, there were 4 generations living under one roof. At their wedding, there were relatives from Cusco and Cerro del Pasco and every point in between. We'd have to spend more than a month there to visit everyone who invited us.
My wife's kids (Sara, 25, and Evan, 22) are younger and have plenty of time left for child-rearing.
My sister is 6 years younger than I, and has three grandkids. Her first grandkid is 10 years old - the 10-year-old's mother, my niece, is 6-weeks younger than my son.
I guess everyone has to find the time that's right for them. I just hope I have a little wisdom left to pass on by the time the grandkids show up...
Later, Geoff

it is so much about finding the we-ness of humanity and subduing the me-ness. the current political realm is all about that dichotomy, in my estimation. there are those who see the world as "us" and those who see it as "me vs. them". government is not inherently good, bad, oppressive - it's only a matter of who we choose to be our government - if we the people choose ourselves to govern and truly participate/contribute for the good of all, then we will have good government. when we outsource, delegate, or submit to rule by the highest bidder, we will have bad government. the lazy and selfish among us choose to do the latter, then impugn all government as "too big, and too bad". those who collaborate, share, and take individual and collective responsibility for the consequences of their decisions and actions will similarly have the government we deserve.
Peace, Geoff with a G

sorry lynn. i've been jammed and still am. it looks like for a while unfortunately.

i have enough time for a couple of quick comments here and there. that's it till some things are settled.

there are many that may be interested in your paper. but you need to find the right forum. you need a place for beginners or intermediates in this area. it's perfect for that.

thx but this stuff is a pita, but needs to be done. i think we all need to reconnect to everything.

that absolutely makes sense. be careful online though. you just never really know.
no e

mostly legal stuff. at the moment i'm writing a huge brief, plus i requested a hearing for something else. all a pita. i have to submit 6 copies of the brief, in the exact format (spacing, font, etc) bound in a certain way and color coded. plus i'm looking for a new apartment. frustrating. stuff like that.

i remember the 'i am not a crook' days. there's prolly a file on me too. hopefully i'm a good influence on your online life. i always err on the side of caution. it's safer. be careful on facebook. to connect on twine - you got a message in your inbox. open it, click accept. that's it. not much of a sense of humor now - too buried in the brief. i'm bleary from looking at it. so i'm taking a short break now.

no e

trying
no e